Let's Talk: Battling Discontentment | Jackie Hill Perry, Melissa Kruger, and Jasmine Holmes | Word First

[Music] welcome back to the second episode of let's talk a new podcast for women from the gospel coalition podcast network where we seek to apply biblical wisdom to everyday life I'm Melissa Krueger director of women's initiatives for tgc and I'm here with my friends Jasmine Holmes and Jackie Hill Perri hey if you didn't catch our first episode on sharing your faith I encourage you to go back and listen because during that time we told each other how we all came to faith in Christ and we got to share a little bit about our lives and what we do with our regular days but today we don't want to spend any time on that because we're gonna jump into a big topic everybody's favorite topic yeah discontentment and this is something I think that we all struggle with in life at least everyone I know does on a regular basis I can remember years ago I was at the park with my kids and we loved this Park all the moms went to it because it had a fence around the playground so the kids were relatively contained while we were at the park one day the older kids came up to all the moms and said hey there's a field just outside the park can we go run around on the field and just keep all the younger kids in the fence and we as the moms look to each other we're like that's not gonna go well if we do that so y'all just need to stay in the playground because beside the field was a big road and so we didn't want to have to be stressed out worrying about it well sure enough I look up five minutes later and every one of those older kids is standing by the fence staring at the field now behind them is a full playground with everything they could have been playing with sandbox swings slide all the fun things they could have been doing and they to stand at the fence and stare and just be mad that they weren't in the fitnah playing in the field and that is the image that comes to my mind every time I see myself discontent it's like I can't see the blessings of God and I just see what's missing and the reality of our lives because we live in a fallen world is that we are all battling with the fact that life isn't always right so let me ask y'all what's the difference between just dealing with the fact that life isn't perfect and then sinful discontentment what how do we know what's just an acceptance and this is a hard day things didn't go as a planned and then what's the difference between know I'm really discontent I think one of the differences is the dwelling on it when I feel discontent I can't move on from it it's all I can really think about it shapes my day it shapes my thoughts and every time I think about that topic I think about how disappointed I am in how things are going in that particular way one of the biggest ways that people talk to me about discontentment throughout my life was definitely during my singleness like people would always say like oh you know single you have to be careful not to be discontinued to be careful not to be discontent and I thought that when I got married discontentment wouldn't be as much of a struggle for me but there's always a new reason I was just like I even one time somebody was like yeah but marriage is hard sometimes like sometimes it's sanctification I was like but I'm really excited than this it's just kind of like the same as your field story looking at cross and thinking ah that's so much better than what I have so yeah not being able to move past it is I don't think that's the defining characteristic but it's definitely something I've noticed I think one way to see the distinction is like is how you're thinking about reality bringing you peace joy or is it making you super like pessimistic because I think discontentment can do that where it's yes this is my reality I am in a home with five children and we have two bedrooms this sucks this is terrible nothing's ever going to get better better I can't believe this is happening to you like when it begins to go down those lines versus yes we have this many children in this home but glory be to God I have a home at all I just I guess the approach to how you see your thoughts and what it even does to your emotional and mental health is a good sign yeah that's a really good point because there are hard things in life yeah so it's like how do we hold what is really sad and that we mourn and that we are struggling in different parts of life because we're not in heaven yeah yeah we're not in the place where all of our desires are met and fulfilled and I find that so hard how do I not just live a fake life where I'm Pollyanna you know perfect over here oh it's all good and it's not no it's really not but then there's some line where it crosses over into I'm sour mm-hmm and I'm kind of not only am i discontent I'm making everyone around me pretty miserable their discontent with this friendship I've been that friend unfortunately I think also to feel taking it to God versus just kind of stewing in it and wallowing in it and sometimes I don't really want to pray and I don't want to I don't really want to change I just want to be upset and just feel cuz I wish like dig into that like yeah don't you wanna press well I'll just be like I just didn't so I just don't I'm just not feeling this I don't like it and if God cared about me you change it mmm without me asking probably it's just spiritual warfare but you know what I mean like just that like you get paralyzed in whatever feeling or whatever ste that you're in and praying it is moving forwards in action it's an action absolutely and so when you're just feeling that inactive just kind of like throw your hands up and not only is my life not what I want it to be but it not being what it wants what I want it to be gives me a license to feel sorry for myself or to take it out on other people or to film the blank I'm just gonna be here like I'm just gonna stay here it's how does contentment often plays out for me or has in the past I think that's part of why when God because I think discontentment is kind of wrapped up in stress and anxiety and worry because I think a lot of times we are discontent around again real things you know my bills my home my health you know you you have people that just want to be healthy just don't want to have to go to the doctor all the time that's fair but I think that might be why God always connects are giving our anxieties and our worries to him and in the motivation being that he cares for us you know like I think it's hard to give him something if we don't believe he cares at all anyway you know because maybe we look at our life or the life stage that we're in and we think that this is somehow a sign that God isn't as good as he says that is because my life isn't as good as I would prefer it to be when that's not the truth I don't think we we judge God's make God based on our circumstances but we judge our circumstances based on who God has revealed himself to be in this song yeah I think that's the biggest root issue for me as I starts judging God and saying prove to me that you're good and really what a shocking sorrowful thing I'm doing because I'm basically saying yeah I know you sent your son to die on a cross for my son who was holy and perfect and did nothing wrong and he died this terrible death but I still am not convinced you love me because my minivan doesn't have sliding doors yeah or whatever stupid thing you know yeah yeah I mean I know our things seem bigger than that but in the reality it's like he says I gave my son for you can you trust me with the others yeah and and it's a really a trust issue I think at some level all of our discontent is really is really rooted and unbelief yeah I agree unbelief that God might not really be good to me yeah I just have like a big like hallelujah praise break dance moment in my head when you said giving we're told to cast our cares upon God because he cares for us and I think so often I know I doubt that care and so that's why the burden casting is not happening and I don't believe me I don't trust other people like other people in the faith to like even my husband I'll be like oh no it'll burden him if I share this Errol no it'll I don't know just fill in the blank and you think of whatever reason not to trust God's care press not trust the care of people who he's put in our lives to help ease those burdens yeah I'm like my brain is kinda blown right now wow that's so true so it's like you guys saying like community I guess can assist us in growing in contentment especially considering the fact that if we're discontent about certain circumstances that can be fixed yeah potentially yeah okay totally or just telling people how you're feeling I remember when I had my first miscarriage it was really hard for me to be around women who were pregnant and it was so hard for me to share that because I felt like that made me a bad person and I couldn't talk about it I couldn't I couldn't verbalize it and two things one thing was a friend of mine who was pregnant her son would have been the same age as mine now which is a really sweet thing actually but she was like hey if I talked to you about my pregnancy is that hard for you or can I still talk to you about that because I'm a big birthday attic always have been and so she was like I have questions or I have thoughts but I want to be aware of you I don't want to be mindful of you that was really helpful for me and something like a check to myself to be mindful of other people and the struggles that they might be having but then on the flip side I have a friend who recently had a loss and she came to me and she told me the exact same feeling that I was too afraid to confess to someone and gave me the opportunity to speak truth into her life whereas if she would have not trusted my care for her if she had not trusted God's care for her in putting somebody who'd walked that road before in her life then she could have just kind of wallet in it and felt completely alone unnecessarily so that's just one example of I guess how I've seen that caring piece of battling contentment carried out we really do need each other in it and when one thing I always find complicated is different commands in Scripture so at one point it says in Thessalonians rejoice always pray continually give thanks in all circumstances for this is God's will for you in Christ Jesus but then on the other hand it says rejoice with those who rejoice and mourn with those who mourn and there's a time for Mourning so how do we hold grief and sadness and joy and rejoicing how do we let those two things walk together but not be an opposition to each other is that possible what does it look like to be able to mourn to be a morning person and a rejoicing person all wrapped up in one I think that's the paradox Paul talks about yeah he's like sorrowful yet rejoicing poor yet making many rich the Christian life isn't just all you know sunshine and puppies yeah and so how did these two things coexist to not be an opposition to one I might be biblically often this please correct me if I am mrs. Kruger but I think in Philippians where Paul says I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me how you know he's not really applying that to I can you know get a degree in X Y & Z but rather I can learn to be abased and I can learn to be abound because of Jesus and so I guess that there is a way in which Jesus is able to empower me to live out this paradox to be like him who is the son of the Living God who is a man of great suffering yet he endures for the joy set before him and how there's this strange partnership going on where he's not yet his his his history I don't know I'm just trying to think his reality doesn't keep him still or stagnant but he continues to move forward because he has a greater reward ahead of him and so I don't know maybe looking to Jesus and figuring out how he did yeah it makes me think about different seasons to some seasons are full of rejoicing and some are full of mourning I always think about whenever Jesus came to raise Lazarus from the dead he knew he's gonna raise him from the dead yeah but he still was in that moment with his sisters who were sat who were grieving and even though the miracle was going to happen and even though ultimately he would raise Lazarus from the dead in the last day and Lazarus would never die again he was still able to inhabit that moment before the resurrection which always is encouraging for me in different times of grief because I think we can confuse grief with discontentment or sadness with this contentment the school um and they're not the same thing I think if you're not I think discontentment is kind of that like we've said not going to God with it and and wallowing in it versus grief which is an honest assessment of where you are and how you're feeling that doesn't doubt who God is so that's a tweet you should tweet her that exact quote tweet that put it on your coffee table your coffee mug with your succulent plant you know that's what Christians love to do buy succulent plants and drink coffee one highlight before we sit the coffee yeah not a bird nope but you done prepared that picture for Instagram I have a question for you I'm wondering like as you have you've been a Christian for how long you're gonna my question is when I was born you were going look at that I'm wondering like as you've grown as a woman and grown as a Christian have you seen discontentment change in relation to just you changing does that make sense like as you grown older how does it does it look differently because I'm sure you didn't you weren't discontent with the same things as a 22 year old as you are now that's a good question thanks for ageing me no you know what I would say actually I think what's changed for me is my perspective on where the discontentment scumming from so I used to think it was a problem of my circumstances and I'd spend all this time thinking well if I could just find the husband or if I could just you know at certain points my husband was in school for a long time so as if we could just have one job be content or whatever it was maybe the next season if we could just get pregnant and have a baby or whatever it might be I thought then I'd be content whereas now I would say what shifted is I recognize I have a heart problem not a circumstance problem and so that changes how I fight the battle I realize I'm gonna be fighting this battle with discontentment my whole life but I fight it differently I don't just try to get my circumstances sorted I go to God and say give me a better picture of Jesus because I recognize I'm always doubting his love for me that's what ultimately it comes down to is when I'm really sinfully discontent not in a mourning or grieving what's genuinely sad like if loss of death that's that's right for us to mourn I'm a love what you're saying jasmine we don't live an unemotional Christian life we're just not stoic yeah Jesus you know he got angry at the temple changers and he cried when Lazarus died he had real human emotions and I think we actually miss out on reflecting him to others if we try to be stoic but what I recognize is what I want is such a deep love for God to be the source of my joy yeah so where I'm looking for the source has changed and to me my discontentment is more of a signpost that I'm looking for life here hmm and rather than even feeling all the failure of it I'm like it's kind of hunger pains you know when you feel a hunger pain you say oh I need to eat and so when I see discontentment I'm like I need to go to Jesus come on here something che Wow insert Tommy's dance hallelujah my god turn around leg and let me wave it let me dance fast up the aisle don't make me dance you don't want to see me dance but that's conversation so that was fire it made me think of like Hannah in First Samuel and how you know she didn't have children and then you got this lady in the house with her that's fixing her spear at all time you know I got all these kids and you don't my husband he's like aren't I worth 10 cents yeah my why are you tripping chill out but how she goes to the temple you know and he says that she cried out to the point that the priest thought she was drawn you know and to me that tells me that she was going to God with this this thing I want a child I don't have a child I'm really irritated and really vexed but here is my pain here are my tears can you change it and I think it's significant that she tells God that if that if he gives her a son she'll give him back and I think part of the issue is if God does change the circumstance if God does give us what it is that we're desiring will we give it back to him will we use it for the reason that was it was given to us in the first place which is to be a means of worship and yeah I don't know that story always encourages me what I should be doing yes there's so many good images because a different character I always think of as Rachael and her sister Leah and they're in this battle of having children well not really a battle because leah is the only one having children and Rachael is so desperate for a child and say you know she finally has Joseph and I don't know if if y'all nervous I looked at my footnote one time and I was like what is you know they always tell you what the Hebrew word means and so Joseph rather than means God has finally answered my prayer and I'm joyful and content Joseph means may he add and I think the cry of discontentment is may he add just a little more because she's looking at her sister and her sisters over there with six children and so she only has one son and her sister has six and so let me ask this question how do you think Envy or kind of looking over the fence at other people how can that feed or discontentment when we're staring over because you start to assume that God as being better to someone else than he is being to you and that's just not the truth God is not he doesn't play favorites you know he reigns on the just and unjust all good gifts come from the Father of lights and so I think it fuels it because I that's just how we are we just compare ourselves with other people I think what has been helpful for me in particular honestly is to just think about heaven because somebody is always gonna have more than me somebody's always going to be smarter than me somebody's always gonna be a better communicator these are the things I compare myself to so it's always gonna you know have those kinds of things which would make me discontent with the good things that God has given me but in heaven I think I'll see so clearly and I'll have all that I thought that I lacked you know I'll have a great body well I don't know if it'll be skinny I don't know how that works I haven't read the revelation but you know I'll have a glorified body so the pain that could come from discontentment with your health that'll be rectified whether it's you want a relationship with your mother that your friend has so you're jealous you're discontent with that all relationships will hold behold and heal like I think thinking about heaven kind of Sobers me to be okay with what I lack now it's it's it's a great point I like to think of it sometimes we live like the airport okay like this is just a transition place yeah but if we went to the airport and tried to make our home we'd be discontent all the time we'd be like I'm sleeping on the floor it's just you know all these people are coming and going out of my life all the time this is the airport mm-hmm and we try to make it our homes and we do pretty well yeah we make it pretty comfortable we but we forget homes coming yeah and I think you're right we're just not very heavenly minded yeah if I'm a compare my situation to anything it needs to be beyond earth that might help me be more I think that Envy piece also has to do with how we esteem ourselves and what we think we deserve sometimes we've been reading at my church have been doing a study about the prophets this over the last couple months and I got to teach about Habakkuk and I was blown away with Habakkuk because the first time that I read the book I was kind of like what a spoiled brat he thinks he's so much better than all these other people and that God should not just in case y'all haven't rent him back in a while because I hadn't read it in forever Habakkuk is a prophet who is asking God why he's allowing so much iniquity to go on in the land and God answers him and says oh my god take care of that but he says he's gonna take care of it with the Babylonians who are not really and not yeah they're not they're not God's people meanings and so Habakkuk response is like what do you mean you're gonna take care of it with with them like they're they're not worthy to take to take care of us like they don't deserve to be higher than us and God answers back to him and they kind of go back and forth and the first time I read it I what a brat like he asked got a question God gave him an answer so you know sorry you don't like the answer Habakkuk but then at the more I started studying it the more I was like oh that's me that's me that's me being like oh god I feel like you know if you really knew what justice was you'd give me this or if you really knew who deserves what then you give me this and I grew a lot more understanding of him not enough to name one of my children after him cuz I back in that'd be rough you know but as a prophet learned a lot about discontent learned a lot about trusting God from digging back into that book and there's so many there are other prophetic books where there's just that conversation with God and that pushing and pulling and tugging of trying to align their will to his which i think is a part of fighting this contentment aligning our will for our life to what God's will is first so you're saying because that's deep that sometimes this contentment comes out of entitlement mm-hmm absolutely that's interesting I'm I won't say every time because honestly there's real little things that don't have to do with something title two but yeah a lot of the time yeah we think we wrote something mm-hmm you know and I don't even think I realized until life didn't start happening how I wanted it to happen the first five years of our marriage we moved five times and like to Arizona to oversee I mean they were big moves you know and I didn't even know that I didn't want that life until I got that life yeah and so I was having all of these arguments and you know it was funny the arguments I was having were not with God I put the argument on my husband it's a one thing I think is that our inner desires when they're not met James talks about this you know what happens when you don't get what you want you quarrel and you fight and so I think one of the places sometimes that we can see our discontentment is where are we getting it in into it with the people we love the most so for me anytime something was hard in my life overseas you know like getting the groceries I blamed him yeah because I didn't want to fight with God you know I wanted to be a good Christian and you know it couldn't be God's fault that my life wasn't just as man you sent me so yes this woman you gave me it's his fault it's his fault and I do think we played the blame game even with the people we love the most sometimes it's your fault because you're not living up to my expectation or you've taken me to this place and so now I feel the freedom to blame you I don't know if you all have had that have you had situations where you put the blame on someone else yes and then I kind of made myself more miserable right because then I'm quarreling and bickering with my husband yes so discontentment often breeds more discontentment right so when we find ourselves kind of in that pit you know of just circling in our minds why my life is harder than everybody else's why it's somebody else's fault that I'm upset how do we get out of that mindset how do we turn to Christ in a new way and really have that mixture of rejoicing and mourning not to just put off the morning but how can we refocus our mind and kind of choose contentment one thing I love that Paul says is that it's learned so I find that really hopeful it didn't just come with the Holy Spirit he says I've learned the secret of contentment nothing so how do we learn that secret I think what you do with your mind is important you know I think you have to notice those thoughts and take them captive and replace them with things that are worthy of praise and so one practical thing might be write a list of all the good things that you have in your life all of have a home I have I can talk I can hear I can see I can taste a food I can cook I have friends I have a church I can go to I don't have like there's so many things worthy of praise that I think it would choke out the things that were so that we're meditating that are stealing the joy and the peace that we should be having so yeah write down all the good stuff that's good and praise God for that's really good remembering that the whole of the Christian life is repentance and belief that's how we become Christian and that's how God continues to sanctify us in our Christianity so we're painting of discontentment where we find it and working to actively believe that God is who he says he is and he has for us what he says yeah has for us yeah that's I think - I love Ephesians 1 and I think just sometimes going through that passage and remember remembering all the ways we've been blessed God the father's love through the sons work by the Holy Spirit's power in our life has given us these eternal gifts yeah you know cuz most of this stuff I'm discontent about is earthly yeah and it's that heavenly looking you know and reminding ourselves of what God has done and I think we just often don't want to do that yeah you know but it really is life-giving to change everything yeah yeah okay so every week on let's talk we're going to talk about some of our favorite things so today since we've been talking about discontentment let's talk about what's your favorite way to relax what what's your happy place what do you like to do - I go to plant nurseries and walk around and buy too many houseplants this is my first year of my life that I've ever had an actual hobby it's my normal hobbies are reading and writing but writing is also in my work and I have to read to be a teacher and so now I have plants as a hobby and I love it I feel like you upload plants a lot I do they're like your children they are like as many pictures of my children who are adorable I have do you name your every nice you only my favorite ones well yeah my momma she's a plant person and she lives with me now so my home is very green but she she names them all and she genders them oh yeah I don't know how they're all women no so I don't know what that means online are men but most you get a feeling like just a set just like I know like I had this beautiful monstera deliciosa and his name is Atticus okay but then I have another pen of monstera and and Sonia and that one's name is Big Mama so you know you just pictures play you my Instagram is nice quiet children right are you know it keeps you my my kitchen in the corner and they just sit in the corner I don't like plants I have fake ones from like Target and stuff I think right now a hobby of mine honestly is to watch Netflix just find a documentary or some type of cooking competition and just watch it it just helps me to you know my brain is working because I'm still watching something informative because I just like to learn stuff but it's not feel like I have to do anything could that go far short whatever but you know I might not get your list of documentaries oh I got a lot of oh that's good I love documentaries and they're amazing my favorite way I'm so boring there's a book you know I just love to read and sit Christian well not Christian books oh well come on explain I just liked it I love to read you know nonfiction historical mm-hm just books that teach you about life I find that I find people just fascinating yeah I basically think biographies are like People magazine for dead people they are yes but it's the full story and so I love to read about like all the Russian Czars and I mean I they're fascinating there was the last one you were the last biography it was actually about this woman she was a spy and world war two okay and they dropped her in to France during World War two and I had no idea there were these female spies she was a she was a British spy and lives in France and I can't remember her name that's so bad but it was if it's a fascinating book it's just like you understand yeah about things that you have idea hat that happen actually happened yeah and she was taken by the Nazis and she was tortured and she lived and all this stuff Wow pretty amazing this is so cool yeah it's fascinating so I actually like to read everything that has nothing to do with my job yes yeah it's just a great yeah and then I love historical fiction I love they're all fiction y'all are fun you know I got fun hobbies plants and biographies we can take a picture of our books yes and then we'll take a picture you watching Top Chef all of that is my thing well thanks for this conversation thanks for being with us and listening to let's talk today on our next episode we're gonna be talking about overcoming Church hurt so we're gonna go from discontentment to church hurt you can subscribe to let's talk through apple podcast Spotify stitcher or wherever you like to get your podcast check out other shows from the Gospel Coalition podcast network at tgc org backslash podcast the Gospel Coalition connects Christians to resources that apply the truth and beauty of the gospel to all of life